Blame

[Phil]

I gave you 3 chances to pick the most obvious answer. Don't buy what you can't afford and ask the government to bail you out.

[Phil]

The gospel accoriding to me here
legoman.proboards18.com/index.cgi?board=Presidential&action=display&thread=1229

[farti1]

I almost voted for neighbors.....gotta keep up with the Jones ya know
I work for a Power Sports Dealership and can not believe some of the financing stories I hear almost daily. People will buy a $12,000 motorcycle with no money down and no trade in and opt for the 2.9% loan with the $49 per month for 2 years. They almost always show up at the 2 year date to trade this bike in and are in shock when we explain to them that they have been paying only interest and very little on the principle. Now we have a 2 year old bike with 10,000 plus miles on it that is worth $2,000 to $4,000 less than what is owed on the loan

[Classicblast]

I voted bankers.

I think bankers and buyers can be split right down the middle on this one. This might be the one economic problem that the government has almost nothing to do with. I don't know that for sure but I think it's the buyers accepting loans that are not within their means to pay it back. And bankers are suppose to advise us though. And that is not what happened, instead the bankers got things sold that was out of the means to be bought but they also knew by the time it blew up they would be long gone.

For the next few years property values are going to fall to the ground. That's going to badly effect my brothers and building but maybe improve the remodeling chapter of their business.
I guess that if you're not planning on selling your property value doesn't matter a great deal but if you are in the moving process that's going to be bad from a selling view.

I like Farti1's post about the motorcycles. Most people don't care about the price or value of their bike just how much the monthly payment is.

[Blastgirl]

I almost voted neighbors but I decided to go with voters because keeping up with the Joneses is something the Buyer decided. The Joneses are responsible to keep up with neighbors at their own rate.

Its ultimately your decision to buy or not.

[fartinggurl]

Sorry but I have to go with the government because they're sending jobs overseas and costing hard-working people their jobs, and they keep giving money to the troops in Iraq, and we're doing more harm than good over there. We got rid of Saddam Hussein. We don't need to be over there anymore. So the government is basically spending money that we don't have. And the fact that the members of congress can give themselves a pay raise doesn't help, either.

I also have to agree that the buyers are to blame. Some people buy things that they can't afford, and didn't need in the first place. Hopefully some of my opinions didn't offend anyone.

[Beangirl]

I am with Classic. It's the dang Government. In California we could not make a State budget. The "Governator" decided to cut ALL state employees, DMV, State hospitals, etc. salaries down to minimum wage 6.50 per hour until a budget is reached.

[fartinggurl]

Oct 9, 2008 20:20:43 GMT -5 Beangirl said:

I am with Classic. It's the dang Government. In California we could not make a State budget. The "Governator" decided to cut ALL state employees, DMV, State hospitals, etc. salaries down to minimum wage 6.50 per hour until a budget is reached.

I think you were talking about me (Fartinggurl). Classic and I do have the same avator, so I can understand some people getting us mixed up.

[Antonio]

I really don't know who to blame but yes Beangirl they are killing us in California, I heard about Arnold's wanting to cut everything how he got that job is still a big question in my mind. Cost of living dosen't make any sense it's a diaster everywhere

[Classicblast]

Fartinggurl don't worry about your opinion offending anyone. There's no way it should. You presented it in a respectful way and if anybody disagrees they need to be just as respectful about how they do it. That's all. It's discussion. And the poll is "Who do YOU blame?" And the writer of the poll (I think Phil) should then be prepared for any answer.

I did put most of the blame on the bankers. I don't think that outsourcing jobs is directly related to the savings and borrowing troubles.

However I am not a fan of outsourcing. In fact, if professional baseball didn't import players from Japan and Korea I might be a major leaguer.
Outsourcing can affect everybody.

For that matter I do try whenever possible to buy American products. That's not always possible.

[Phil]

What gets me is several fold.
1. The thing I have maintained as long as this thread is how these people allowed themselves to get in this level of debt without seeing the obvious problems.

2. How did they ever get the credit in the 1st place. Anytime I bought cars, my house or applied for any credit cards they did an involved credit check.
My credit is good and I always got approved but they also always found out what I had.
When my truck was brand new they researched me and noted my mortgage, the note on my wife's car, all my credit cards and the amount of dependents [kids]

How did so many different people avoid all that?

[Jersey]

I voted government. They're the ones that decided the loan companies were "racist" and forced them to make high risk, low interest loans to minorities. The loans weren't paid back, foreclosure ensued, and the economy went down the toilet.

My 2 cents.

[Classicblast]

I am not sure as if this 700 billion dollar proposal is really the solution but I'm not sure there was a choice either at this stage.

[dannyboy]

I read this poll but didn't vote in it.

I'm going to blame neighbors because it's so much more fun to point over there and say "IT was them. They did it, it's their fault."

[Phil]

I still think the buyers are mostly responsible that's because they should know what they can afford.

I'll buy that some things are subjective. I might see a glass as half full and you may see it as half empty. However a 12 oz glass that is half full or half empty still has 6 oz of water in it.

If you tell me that if I drink it through a straw it's going to have the same refreshment quality as 2 gallons of water I should not be duped by that.

[Kimm]

Im going with the bankers on this. I understand what Phil is saying you should know what you can afford but when you go to the bank for the loan theyre suppose to be the service professional they need to be able to help you figure out how to help you.

I cant read an MRI so if they tell me I have torn cartilage and need surgery I have to trust them and if theyre wrong or misleading thats more their fault. I know if my elbow hurts but not necessarily what the problem is.

I would have to say the bankers for that reason they knew most of these people were not going to be able to pay their loans but they put them through took whatever payment was coming to them and let everybody else hang.

[thunderbird]

Buyers. Everybody would be accountable but buyers should know if they're biting off more than they can chew.

My vote for the buyers does not absolve the government or the banks though. There should have been some conditions to the bail out too not just give them the money that should be enough to get them out of trouble.

I employ about 140 people in the summer and over 90 year around. If there's financial trouble and I tell a couple guys that we are hurting but we would like to keep you employed. So we will be reducing our summer help this year and instead of hiring 50 people for the summer we are going to hire 10. That makes it so the rest of us are going to have to sweep up their own shavings, pick up lunch for themselves and not have some 20 year old college students to do slave work.

Besides that you might have to give up 20 days down time pay and settle for a 8 day vacation. in a years time.

Yeah that tightens your belt a little but not severely and you keep your job. A no reply means losing your job. Isnt' it smarter to take the deal? Those ceos of big companies don't see it this way.

[Phil]

Too many people have become dependent on government saving them. Some of it is nurtured by the government but there's people really taking advantage too. In the long run they're not winning but it seems like that on the surface sometimes.