criminals get more support then victims

[angel607]

i just read a story that made me so mad. there are donations coming in for the boston bombing suspect. because they told their mother they didn't do it people have decided they are innocent. which I thought I read where the one guy admitted they were going to bomb new york next. the brother that is alive has $8,000.00 in donations from people. what's wrong with people giving money to scum like this when their victims have to have surgery that is really expensive because of limbs blowing off and what do they get? money is going to the person who destroyed all of their lives including a little kid who is dead because of them. it makes me sick.

[Classicblast]

It makes me sick too. I know somewhere along the line Phil made a video saying that the Sandyhook school killer killing himself solved this very scenario from happening.

Obviously that's a harsh way to look at it but its true in many ways too. This is going to bring attention to these guys and convince people as if this is all a hoax.

[Beangirl]

I agree.. Jodi Arias was selling her "Art work" in jail and she is asking her supporters for money to help her buy things from the jail canteen. Fortunately now that she is a convicted felon she can no longer sell her stuff. She was even selling her panties on E-Bay! EWE!

[Phil]

There were big fundraisers for OJ Simpson. He was found not guilt although I for 1 believe he was. The law and jury saw it different.

But while on trial there were elaborate fundraisers where celebrities and football fans were bringing out big money for his defense teams and to support those involved. And for what? Because he was a famous football player?

No matter how good a football player he may have been he shouldn't have been exonerated for murder. But that does happen. The Goldman family and the Brown family have received little or no justice some 19 years later.

[angel607]

i can't believe anyone would support jodi after what she did. I could never donate money to someone who took the life of another human being for no reason. I remember the O.J trial the day the verdict came out of not guilty. I was in school watching it and gasps were herd around the room. he wrote a book called if I had done it this is what I would of done and made money off it. what a slap in the face to his kids and the victims families.

[Kimm]

It does seem that the law has too much compassion for the criminal and not enough for the innocent victims.

[Jersey]

I'll look at this from an anthropological perspective, since this point of view is one of the more useful things I learned in graduate school and really helped me understand why this happens.

A lot of great points have been brought up already about the type of people that often get support from seedy individuals that sit within our population. People donating to the Boston Bomber support him because there's a number of people who think he's doing honorable Islamic fundamentalist work by killing innocent people. There are also a slew of women who think he's hot stuff and spend their nights (alone, I hope) in the throes of their ultimate bad boy fantasy. I've seen the twitter posts; they're out there. Scott Peterson, who is on death row for murdering his wife Lacey and unborn child Connor, still gets marriage proposals by the dozen. Daily. People support OJ Simpson because some may actually believe that he was innocent, but a good chunk of that group feels he did it but was justified in what he did because of the races and circumstances of his victims.

Just like Arias, John Wayne Gacy also sold his artwork out of prison. Often it was supporters of the victims that bought it so they could burn it. People were also supporting the murderer Chris Dorner, the cop that went on a shooting rampage a couple months back. And one doesn't need to look far within the Internet to find worshippers and admirers of serial killers. The obsessions with the Zodiac killer and Jack the Ripper come to mind.

What's my point? Think of how much everyone loves a rebel. Someone against the grain. How girls may be attracted to a "bad boy". Now take a social deviant, or a rebel with a more significant departure from societal standards of decent behavior and you get the people who support the evil ones I mentioned before. The evil doers are the true deviants, and their worshippers are those who have similar desires but lack the balls to act on them.

To me, it serves some good to know that these people are out there. The withdrawn woman you just passed by earlier on the street quite possibly thinks about how much she wants a rough man to just throttle her nearly to death during intimate times. The guy working at the cash register who is in his 40s with that angry look on his face might dream at night of blowing up his old high school where he was bullied daily.

Rebelling as a teenager and going against the grain is part of growing up, so there isn't generalizing there. There are some exceptions to that, like the Columbine shooters. But real adult deviants, like the ones who harbor admiration instead of disgust for the people I mentioned before, are the ones who could potentially become dangerous.

[Beangirl]

I believe women who follow and marry mass killers in prison or on death row are mostly attracted to the fact that these relationships cannot ever be "normal". There spouses will never leave prison, there for the commitment and lifestyle are void. It is the fear of traditional marriage and family, so they pick someone who can never fulfill that.

[Phil]

Jun 10, 2013 11:46:29 GMT -5 Beangirl said:

I believe women who follow and marry mass killers in prison or on death row are mostly attracted to the fact that these relationships cannot ever be "normal". There spouses will never leave prison, there for the commitment and lifestyle are void. It is the fear of traditional marriage and family, so they pick someone who can never fulfill that.

That's a very good point Beangirl.
They might want the distinction of marriage and not really want to live the married life. Like you said how domestic can such a marriage be?

But I also think that criminals who get high publicity also attract curious weak minded people who are glory seekers want a little excitement and end up somehow making a hero of the criminal.

Stories like that make it that this person may be misunderstood or confused but not really the 'monster' the rest of you think.


Jersey, ever think about writing? Some of your posts are explicit and articulate enough that they're worthy of being a news paper article. *not to change the subject* just to point that out.

[Jersey]

Phil, I have actually. More than a few times. The only thing is what to write about.

I actually wanted to add that the reason the people supporting the criminal deviants seem so prominent is because in a civil society it is considered so outrageous. So, naturally, it gets a lot of attention. The news media in this country has a serious tendency to blow things ridiculously out of proportion. As an example, one would think that the nation is going insane and gun violence is on the rise. But it's purposeful propaganda; they're covering the stories of gun violence in increased frequency to sway public opinion in the direction of the liberal democrats, who want to ban guns and repeal the second amendment, thereby transferring more power to the government to "protect" a defenseless citizenry. The truth of the matter is that gun violence is actually at its lowest level in history. That's not to say that Columbine, Sandy Hook, Tucson, or others aren't absolute tragedies. They are. But people seeking to politicize these events in order to advance an agenda or ideology should be looked at with scorn and disgust at the minimum. And that actually goes for BOTH sides.

Just because the media says things are happening and out of control, doesn't mean the situation is getting as bad as they say it is... These events are rare, and the people who support these criminals represent a small minority of random individuals.

[Phil]

I am kind of an oldtimer here, and news media was always after a good story but the last 20 or 25 years its more so since CNN, Fox, MSNBC and whoever else has 24 hour news channels they are constantly hungry for a story.

I grew up the initial 17 years of my life without cable television. It was around but we didn't have it. I was going into my senior year of high school when my parents decided to have cable put in the house. My point being I grew up without all these channels and 5 or 6 24 hour news channels. the need for a story is so pressing that they squeeze every last detail and debate out of each and every happening that makes the press.

For Jersey I think you could write about any topic enough people in the press move around on what they cover. I remember when Bryant Gumbo covered NBC baseball and football games before he hosted TODAY.

[angel607]

jersey your exactly right. I never understood why people want to donate money to people who do such horrible things but when the sandy hook shooting took place there was fan pages set up for the shooter and labeled him as a entertainer. these pages were reported and taken down because the victims and families don't need to see that. I saw comments about how Casey Anthony doesn't belong in jail because she's so hot and more gross comments. I can understand wanting to donate because the person might be innocent but there's no way I would support anyone who did horrible crimes.

[Kimm]

They post internet ways to send donations to the prisoner. I think once convicted they should be deprived of all rights except for the very basic of all rights.

[Phil]

Lawyers make heros or victims out of the criminal.

[Phil]

For all that matter, Charles Manson still has a following.

[DragonLady]

Jun 10, 2013 8:12:31 GMT -5 Jersey said:

I'll look at this from an anthropological perspective, since this point of view is one of the more useful things I learned in graduate school and really helped me understand why this happens.

A lot of great points have been brought up already about the type of people that often get support from seedy individuals that sit within our population. People donating to the Boston Bomber support him because there's a number of people who think he's doing honorable Islamic fundamentalist work by killing innocent people. There are also a slew of women who think he's hot stuff and spend their nights (alone, I hope) in the throes of their ultimate bad boy fantasy. I've seen the twitter posts; they're out there. Scott Peterson, who is on death row for murdering his wife Lacey and unborn child Connor, still gets marriage proposals by the dozen. Daily. People support OJ Simpson because some may actually believe that he was innocent, but a good chunk of that group feels he did it but was justified in what he did because of the races and circumstances of his victims.

Just like Arias, John Wayne Gacy also sold his artwork out of prison. Often it was supporters of the victims that bought it so they could burn it. People were also supporting the murderer Chris Dorner, the cop that went on a shooting rampage a couple months back. And one doesn't need to look far within the Internet to find worshippers and admirers of serial killers. The obsessions with the Zodiac killer and Jack the Ripper come to mind.

What's my point? Think of how much everyone loves a rebel. Someone against the grain. How girls may be attracted to a "bad boy". Now take a social deviant, or a rebel with a more significant departure from societal standards of decent behavior and you get the people who support the evil ones I mentioned before. The evil doers are the true deviants, and their worshippers are those who have similar desires but lack the balls to act on them.

To me, it serves some good to know that these people are out there. The withdrawn woman you just passed by earlier on the street quite possibly thinks about how much she wants a rough man to just throttle her nearly to death during intimate times. The guy working at the cash register who is in his 40s with that angry look on his face might dream at night of blowing up his old high school where he was bullied daily.

Rebelling as a teenager and going against the grain is part of growing up, so there isn't generalizing there. There are some exceptions to that, like the Columbine shooters. But real adult deviants, like the ones who harbor admiration instead of disgust for the people I mentioned before, are the ones who could potentially become dangerous.

What's interesting is to think about it from a psychological point. Like some of the things you mentioned, possible reasons why someone is the way they are. These crazy people got famous for horrible things, and it gets attention. A big part of that is because the media makes the story instead of report it, but that's beside the point. The examples you mention, such as the woman who wants to be brutalized, why would anyone enjoy that? Something's not right there if a person gets into destructive relationships all the time. I know people who do too. They won't go for the one who's nice, but always someone awful. As for the people who take revenge over something they can't get over, was it just years of taking crap off everyone that made them go to pieces, or is there something wrong with them to begin with? Pretty much every incident I've heard of there's something going on not right with them. There are people who out of curiosity, write to an inmate in prison, famous or not. Some are simply curious, nothing more, others might have more of a worrisome obsession with the wrong sort. Curiosity isn't a bad thing if all you want to do is learn something, but when that can't be seperated from support for their actions, it's just not good. The followers want to be close to them, so they go along with it.

[Jersey]

Jun 22, 2013 22:47:39 GMT -5 DragonLady said:

Jun 10, 2013 8:12:31 GMT -5 Jersey said:

I'll look at this from an anthropological perspective, since this point of view is one of the more useful things I learned in graduate school and really helped me understand why this happens.

A lot of great points have been brought up already about the type of people that often get support from seedy individuals that sit within our population. People donating to the Boston Bomber support him because there's a number of people who think he's doing honorable Islamic fundamentalist work by killing innocent people. There are also a slew of women who think he's hot stuff and spend their nights (alone, I hope) in the throes of their ultimate bad boy fantasy. I've seen the twitter posts; they're out there. Scott Peterson, who is on death row for murdering his wife Lacey and unborn child Connor, still gets marriage proposals by the dozen. Daily. People support OJ Simpson because some may actually believe that he was innocent, but a good chunk of that group feels he did it but was justified in what he did because of the races and circumstances of his victims.

Just like Arias, John Wayne Gacy also sold his artwork out of prison. Often it was supporters of the victims that bought it so they could burn it. People were also supporting the murderer Chris Dorner, the cop that went on a shooting rampage a couple months back. And one doesn't need to look far within the Internet to find worshippers and admirers of serial killers. The obsessions with the Zodiac killer and Jack the Ripper come to mind.

What's my point? Think of how much everyone loves a rebel. Someone against the grain. How girls may be attracted to a "bad boy". Now take a social deviant, or a rebel with a more significant departure from societal standards of decent behavior and you get the people who support the evil ones I mentioned before. The evil doers are the true deviants, and their worshippers are those who have similar desires but lack the balls to act on them.

To me, it serves some good to know that these people are out there. The withdrawn woman you just passed by earlier on the street quite possibly thinks about how much she wants a rough man to just throttle her nearly to death during intimate times. The guy working at the cash register who is in his 40s with that angry look on his face might dream at night of blowing up his old high school where he was bullied daily.

Rebelling as a teenager and going against the grain is part of growing up, so there isn't generalizing there. There are some exceptions to that, like the Columbine shooters. But real adult deviants, like the ones who harbor admiration instead of disgust for the people I mentioned before, are the ones who could potentially become dangerous.

What's interesting is to think about it from a psychological point. Like some of the things you mentioned, possible reasons why someone is the way they are. These crazy people got famous for horrible things, and it gets attention. A big part of that is because the media makes the story instead of report it, but that's beside the point. The examples you mention, such as the woman who wants to be brutalized, why would anyone enjoy that? Something's not right there if a person gets into destructive relationships all the time. I know people who do too. They won't go for the one who's nice, but always someone awful. As for the people who take revenge over something they can't get over, was it just years of taking crap off everyone that made them go to pieces, or is there something wrong with them to begin with? Pretty much every incident I've heard of there's something going on not right with them. There are people who out of curiosity, write to an inmate in prison, famous or not. Some are simply curious, nothing more, others might have more of a worrisome obsession with the wrong sort. Curiosity isn't a bad thing if all you want to do is learn something, but when that can't be seperated from support for their actions, it's just not good. The followers want to be close to them, so they go along with it.

There's always a psychological perspective that comes along with analyzing social deviancy. The cause of it could very well be stemming from something that happened during childhood or in an early relationship. My example of the fictional girl who prefers to be brutalized might have been molested as a child. Or treated like human trash by an older boyfriend when she was a young teenager. But getting enjoyment out of it would have to come out of her thinking it is somehow normal. Sometimes, people simply haven't been taught what is supposed to be right. Therefore they believe otherwise.

As for curiosity, seeking knowledge and going directly to the source for it can sometimes be the single best way to acquire the sought information. The point where it crosses into deviancy is when the curious knowledge seeker begins to believe in what they are being told by the source of information. Such as an atheist that might seek out a cult or Satanism. It's perfectly natural to be curious, to find out and seek knowledge. But believing in the information that they receive back, letting it influence them? If that believed information comes from a societal deviant like a murderer or rapist, the line has been crossed.

[DragonLady]

Uually it is a childhood thing. Like on Intervention if you've seen that, there's always something that went wrong growing up. Still, that doesn't excuse people turning out rotten. For these psychopath criminals however, mental illness and personality disorders are always present somehow.

You have to be careful going straight to the source, because many of them are master manipulators and can get to anyone who lets them.